Welcome to the Invelos forums. Please read the forum rules before posting.

Read access to our public forums is open to everyone. To post messages, a free registration is required.

If you have an Invelos account, sign in to post.

    Invelos Forums->General: General Home Theater Discussion Page: 1 2  Previous   Next
Are HD broadcast movies just upconverted STD?
Author Message
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Being relatively new to the whole 1080i HD and 16x9 Hi Def Broadcasting, I was under the impression that films that were broadcast on HDNET /HBO or Movie Central were the real McCoy., Such an example would be the newly telecast version of Bonnie & Clyde these past few weeks. The HDD and Blu Ray Discs are soon to be on the market later this month in April.

Which when I think about it.., Why would Warners release a version that has yet to come to market? it would be like giving away your baby before it is born.
Last night I had occasion to sample Amadeus on HDNET and as impressed as I was.,, I compared my Directors Cut (2001 ed.) to the Broadcast I had captured on my PVR.
Results?
No difference noticeable  as I played back my Directors Cut version from DVD on my Toshiba A3 Hi- Def 'upconversion' to 1080i .  Which as happy as I can be that I can save a lot of coin by not changing over my current library of Standard DVD (480i) to HD versions ( of course I would have to invest in Bluray, but that's a whole differant thread..) 
So question is: Are the studios only releasing versions of their films not currently sold in HiDEF format as an upconverted signal?,, just as my Toshiba player gives me to my Sony 46" LCD projection TV as a 1080i signal ?????
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
 Last edited: by widescreenforever
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributor?
?
Registered: March 14, 2007
Posts: 3,830
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageDirect link to this postReply with quote
you would at least expect a simular difference as in:
Spider-man (Blu-ray) review with superbit DVD comparison.

How Does Standard DVD 720p/1080i/1080p Upscaling Compare to

hope this already of some help.
Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Sorry Giga,, My thread was to compare HD Movie broadcasting against STD  DVd  not Superbit against BluRay...   
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantDr. Killpatient
Here's my card
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 5,917
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
It's compressed HD but still HD.  Get up close and personal with your TV and look at the smoother areas, you'll see a lot of mpeg artifacts.  Also keep in mind that not all HD channels are transmitted as 1080, some are only 720.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting Dr. Killpatient:
Quote:
It's compressed HD but still HD.  Get up close and personal with your TV and look at the smoother areas, you'll see a lot of mpeg artifacts.  Also keep in mind that not all HD channels are transmitted as 1080, some are only 720.


If I click on 'Info'  with my remote  it says 1080i.,,  plus my PVDR HD box is set for 1080 rather than 720 , would this make a differance?
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorFunkyLA
Will you remove your hat?
Registered: March 13, 2007
United Kingdom Posts: 1,136
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
ok, on the xbox 360, a HD movie download is about 4 to 6 GB

Which means... there is a heck of compression going on, when a HD DVD or Blu Ray disc can cope with 20GB+

You do the math - and Microsoft thinks Digital Rentals is the future..... maybe... but if I pay for HD, I want HD!

I would guess most Cable/Sat providers do the same.... bandwidth costs... why waste it (more profit!)
Signature? We don't need no stinking... hang on, this has been done... blast [oooh now in Widescreen]
Ah... well you see.... I thought I'd say something more interesting... but cannot think of anything..... oh well
And to those of you who have disabled viewing of these signature files "hello" (or not) Registered: July 27, 2004
 Last edited: by FunkyLA
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantDr. Killpatient
Here's my card
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 5,917
Posted:
PM this userView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting widescreenforever:
Quote:
If I click on 'Info'  with my remote  it says 1080i.,,  plus my PVDR HD box is set for 1080 rather than 720 , would this make a differance?

You're getting a 1080 picture and it will be significantly better than a SD broadcast but it still won't touch Blu-Ray quality.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributor?
?
Registered: March 14, 2007
Posts: 3,830
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting widescreenforever:
Quote:
Sorry Giga,, My thread was to compare HD Movie broadcasting against STD  DVd  not Superbit against BluRay...   

there fore the second link, the first nearly to document what noticeable viewing difference...
Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Agreed..,,  BUT if you see an advertisement that HDNET etc  is going to Show Lawrence of Arabia  or Lost Boys in HD .. we don't have to GAG too much because UNTIL the BD  comes along there is nothing to fret about..  right?  ( The upconversion of our regular STD  discs will be sufficient is what I'm aiming here for here in this thread.. I am NOT comparing BD to HD broadcasting.., Please.. )
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
 Last edited: by widescreenforever
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting FunkyLA:
Quote:
ok, on the xbox 360, a HD movie download is about 4 to 6 GB

Which means... there is a heck of compression going on, when a HD DVD or Blu Ray disc can cope with 20GB+

You do the math - and Microsoft thinks Digital Rentals is the future..... maybe... but if I pay for HD, I want HD!

I would guess most Cable/Sat providers do the same.... bandwidth costs... why waste it (more profit!)


Exactly.. The Whole HD cable experience for Hollywood Movies is a Myth.. Mind you there are some great featurettes on the specialty channels that are not available on DVD that look great on HD TV, but this 'compression factor'  does not warrant a true HD experience we currently are able to see with our HD players / HD discs and HD TV sets.
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantpauls42
Reg: 31/01/2003
Registered: March 13, 2007
United Kingdom Posts: 2,692
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting FunkyLA:
Quote:
ok, on the xbox 360, a HD movie download is about 4 to 6 GB

Which means... there is a heck of compression going on, when a HD DVD or Blu Ray disc can cope with 20GB+

You do the math - and Microsoft thinks Digital Rentals is the future..... maybe... but if I pay for HD, I want HD!

I would guess most Cable/Sat providers do the same.... bandwidth costs... why waste it (more profit!)


one of the things that was putting me off upgrading to HD tv set was that I'm on virgin with a V+ box and so far there is only a single HD channel. But if a true HD signal is only going to be with blu-ray then I may be mistaken on waiting.

Do you have HD and if so is the TV high def just as bad for us as for Canadians?
Paul
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwidescreenforever
Under A Double DoubleW
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
Canada Posts: 5,491
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting pauls42:
Quote:

Do you have HD and if so is the TV high def just as bad for us as for Canadians?

My Canadian Cable service here offers us as many as 40 odd channels in Hi def,, The resolution is 1080i and the regular cable broadcast is around 480 and Less..  Out of the three things I like about HD broadcast is the automatic anamorphic screen fill to 1:78.1  is good., the audio is ( if broadcast)  in 5.1 surround., and the image is either 720i  or 1080i  depending on how your receivers are set. The images being delivered via cablevision ( Shaw in my area) is so so reception..  There are audio dropouts and the odd 'pixelation'  in a two hour broadcast that would deter me from finishing watching the broadcast.  BUT There are surprises too, Like when I caught a Blue Man Group show taped Last October in Dallas Texas.  The HDNET 90 min feature astounded me with the colors and sound and the style of the 'rock' show is encouraging me to try and find the DVD.   
In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.

Terry
 Last edited: by widescreenforever
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorFunkyLA
Will you remove your hat?
Registered: March 13, 2007
United Kingdom Posts: 1,136
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting pauls42:
Quote:
one of the things that was putting me off upgrading to HD tv set was that I'm on virgin with a V+ box and so far there is only a single HD channel. But if a true HD signal is only going to be with blu-ray then I may be mistaken on waiting.

Do you have HD and if so is the TV high def just as bad for us as for Canadians?

I do not have HD via set-top... but my mother has

At the mo, only BBC HD is in operation on Virgin, and from what I can see, it is obvious when you are watching a HD show on it (when compared to SD digital)

The bandwidth used for HD programmes is about 3 to 4 times the size of SD, but still not near BD or HD-DVD levels (nor will it get there for some time.... transmission rates vs bandwidth vs cost)

However, from what I have seen, things like "Britain: How a country was made" and so on are worth the effort, providing you have the right set up (have also caught Sky's "Colour of Magic" in HD at a friends (and compared it to the SD version - HD is REALLY clear)

If you have a small TV, then you will not really notice the increase in detail, but the bigger the screen, the more you will see the "more" infomation that is supplied in a HD show

One thing to note, Virgin (on the V+ service) provide a lot of shows free in HD format, from suppliers like HBO and Discovery.

So, e.g. "Band of Brothers" is available for free viewing, at anytime.... you have to hunt for it

Virgin say that they will be adding content to the V+ service in HD as and when they can source it, however, most people are waiting for them to launch more "normal" channels in HD (Like Channel 4 HD and ITV HD, etc etc)

Sky, however, have a large number of channels in HD, from the Movies (and Pay Per View "box office") to Discovery Channel HD and National Geographic. (They also supply some sport events in HD - though there is an arguement over "is 720p better than 1080p" for fast moving actions)

Finally, without looking, I am not sure if any UK supplier runs in 1080p or 1080i

I will end with this, if you have a reason to upgrade, then getting the HD service "might" be worth it

If you "just" want the nice pics... wait a while

Oh, and finally, the Freeview group (Digital Terristial Transmisions in UK) have just anounced that they will be working towards a HD Freeview channel or 5.... but we will need a new box, and not until the whole country switches off the analogue signal! (the new box is for the new "codec" that they will be using for the HD channels)

Hope this all helps
Signature? We don't need no stinking... hang on, this has been done... blast [oooh now in Widescreen]
Ah... well you see.... I thought I'd say something more interesting... but cannot think of anything..... oh well
And to those of you who have disabled viewing of these signature files "hello" (or not) Registered: July 27, 2004
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantpauls42
Reg: 31/01/2003
Registered: March 13, 2007
United Kingdom Posts: 2,692
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Thanks, FunkyLA.

I have the V+ box already (I paid a one-off price). So I shall just have to wait until there is more HD content. I will however have a look at what is available as shows - I hadn't realised they would have any of those..

cheers
Paul
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantnolesrule
Registered: 09/21/2000
Registered: March 15, 2007
United States Posts: 366
Posted:
PM this userEmail this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
Quoting widescreenforever:
Quote:
If I click on 'Info'  with my remote  it says 1080i.,,  plus my PVDR HD box is set for 1080 rather than 720 , would this make a differance?


All this means is that non-1080i material is upconverted to 1080i in the box.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorFunkyLA
Will you remove your hat?
Registered: March 13, 2007
United Kingdom Posts: 1,136
Posted:
PM this userVisit this user's homepageView this user's DVD collectionDirect link to this postReply with quote
See this (Cable HD not so high-def, say subscribers)?

Makes intresting reading

Basically, "Some cable providers, most notably Comcast, are receiving even more flak over the quality of their high-def programming. The problem has been getting HD signals to fit in the given bandwidth, and now it may be taking a toll on quality."
Signature? We don't need no stinking... hang on, this has been done... blast [oooh now in Widescreen]
Ah... well you see.... I thought I'd say something more interesting... but cannot think of anything..... oh well
And to those of you who have disabled viewing of these signature files "hello" (or not) Registered: July 27, 2004
    Invelos Forums->General: General Home Theater Discussion Page: 1 2  Previous   Next